Where The Slime Lives blog

[L Macey]

[quote name="Drum Solo"]



So I guess the live shows don't pick up the slack, or what?[/quote]



Mithras haven't ever been able to get a live drummer who could:

a) play the drums close to how I play them on the records to the point I can enjoy it and at the same time

b) be a reliable stable person who wants to commit to the band and

c) not be an intolerable egomaniacal maniac with adhd

so that's put the kybosh on doing many live shows so far.



Sean Broster who we had last after he left the marines was a total animal on drums, probably the hard-on bearer with the most drumming potential I've ever seen but he won't commit which is a shame as he's such a cool hard-on bearer.



For other bands live shows are definitely the money maker these days assuming they can get a proper guarantee.

[RitesOfPossession]

[quote name="L Macey"]
[quote name="Drum Solo"]



So I guess the live shows don't pick up the slack, or what?[/quote]

For other bands live shows are definitely the money maker these days assuming they can get a proper guarantee.[/quote]

I get the impression that will playing live and going on the road can support a band and further their career it provides nowhere near enough money to support band members in their private lives.

[L Macey]

[quote name="DarkSurgeon"]
[quote name="L Macey"]
[quote name="Drum Solo"]



So I guess the live shows don't pick up the slack, or what?[/quote]

For other bands live shows are definitely the money maker these days assuming they can get a proper guarantee.[/quote]

I get the impression that will playing live and going on the road can support a band and further their career it provides nowhere near enough money to support band members in their private lives.[/quote]



Indeed. The thing is, it's great to be able to say "we broke even on these shows" as in we didn't LOSE any money. But thinking about it you did lose as you didn't earn anything while away, took time off work, and weren't paying your mortgage etc etc. This has been done to death on Derek's forum already and a lot of people don't like what he says. I think it's refreshing to hear the other side of the story, even if it's biased towards the negative a bit.

[Drum Solo]

[quote name="L Macey"]
[quote name="Drum Solo"]



So I guess the live shows don't pick up the slack, or what?[/quote]



Mithras haven't ever been able to get a live drummer who could:

a) play the drums close to how I play them on the records to the point I can enjoy it and at the same time

b) be a reliable stable person who wants to commit to the band and

c) not be an intolerable egomaniacal maniac with adhd

so that's put the kybosh on doing many live shows so far.



Sean Broster who we had last after he left the marines was a total animal on drums, probably the hard-on bearer with the most drumming potential I've ever seen but he won't commit which is a shame as he's such a cool hard-on bearer.



For other bands live shows are definitely the money maker these days assuming they can get a proper guarantee.[/quote]



That sucks.



I can imagine why it'd be hard to find a drummer simply because even a basic set is so expensive, and it's hard to find a place to practice to the point where complex stuff is second nature.



I was thinking of getting a set and renting out a garage to jam on it, but that's just because I can at the moment and it'd be fun. Bands are a lot of work though, and guys who want to blast away on drums are probably complete nuts anyway.

[jawn galliano]

[quote name="Drum Solo"]I don't know anything about this, but I thought he had a decent job in a car manufacturing factory - like $20+ hour. Unless the hard-on bearer has an extensive family you'd think that would be enough to get by with a relatively simple lifestyle (not sure if he lives that way, but I do fine on a meager wage as a single hard-on bearer).



But after reading that Derrek Roddy thing that was posted here, I do know that Roddy was insistent that you basically cannot make a living playing death metal. So maybe there are other factors at play.[/quote]



It's a definite possibility, there's a BMW plant in Greer which is halfway between where Karl lives and where I used to live. That's where Z4's are (were?) built!



I don't know what his living situation is, but at 20/hr supplemented with some side cash from nile, you could live very comfortably in upstate South Carolina. Cost of living there is pretty low overall, especially housing and real estate.

[Conservative_Heretic]

[quote name="L Macey"]
[quote name="DarkSurgeon"]
[quote name="L Macey"]
[quote name="Drum Solo"]



So I guess the live shows don't pick up the slack, or what?[/quote]

For other bands live shows are definitely the money maker these days assuming they can get a proper guarantee.[/quote]

I get the impression that will playing live and going on the road can support a band and further their career it provides nowhere near enough money to support band members in their private lives.[/quote]



Indeed. The thing is, it's great to be able to say "we broke even on these shows" as in we didn't LOSE any money. But thinking about it you did lose as you didn't earn anything while away, took time off work, and weren't paying your mortgage etc etc. This has been done to death on Derek's forum already and a lot of people don't like what he says. I think it's refreshing to hear the other side of the story, even if it's biased towards the negative a bit.[/quote]



This all just give me that much more of an appreciation for live music and metal in general. It motivates me even more so coming out of this drought to see bands, especially local ones, buy there merchandise and spread the word. I had suspicions that the life is much different (harder) than perhaps a fan may realize. Again, thanks for the behind the scenes look at what goes on and how hard it really is. I don't think I will ever buy another bootleg item or copy rip-off again now. From Derek's post and what has been written here; I am converted.

[Those Insane Gods]

I can totally understand that it's a hard toll on a many bands. Touring and not even being able to make a living off of it. But it's also a privilege (maybe less so today) to be able to share your music and have people coming out to see you. They could be making money too. Instead they come to your show to share your vision and support your product. It's not all about the money. Am I making any sense?

[L Macey]

It's true that downloading and the ability for anyone to steal any music or films they choose to with no repercussions has totally changed the industry and music in general and I think in the next 10 years we'll see the after effects. The stuff that'll survive is stuff backed up by big advertising and product placement and the actual record will stop becoming the product but rather a means to do live shows and merchandise, this has all been said by people before. The other side is mega cult underground bands with limited releases and vinyls, which seems to be doing well atm.



I used to get really pissed off about it all and I've posted a load of rants on facebook and the Mithras forum but there's just no point, it's like bailing out the Titanic with a tea cup. For everyone who understands my frustrations there's some 16 year old kid who thinks he's done me a massive favour by uploading my records to 10 of his mates.



The argument it's not all about the money is true, assuming you can personally justify losing money to essentially provide entertainment to other people for free. If you're one of those people who loves getting loads of attention all the time then you can just become a youtube whore these days - The net has enabled people to just chuck anything out there and has lowered the quality control aspect for sure, which has made it harder for people to find decent music.



The thing is, most metal bands never "made" money, they just managed to eke back a bit to cover their costs, when it's a total lose lose lose situation it's just not worth bothering anymore for a lot of bands. Bands always got a meagre cut of the pie (see the Berzerkers video where he breaks down the royalties they received for example) but now a lot of bands just get nothing, no royalties and someone condescendingly saying "YOU'RE VERY LUCKY TO EVEN GET A CD RELEASED YOUNG MAN!". When you've spent $5000 on recording a record and you're the only people not getting any $ return you can understand why it can be disheartening and having someone saying to you "well you're lucky people are listening to your music" might put your nose out of joint.



But obviously, bands have to realise what the lie of the land is these days, and not plough money into a record you know you'll lose, people have to wake up and accept the current situation or find a way of making it work for them. And not sign all their rights away to labels.



Mithras were quite lucky to start in 1998 before downloading was a problem, we got great support from our first label Golden Lake who did tonnes of pr then got really good ££ advances from Candlelight for the reissues and 'Behind The Shadows' (which we didn't spend on Motorbikes and beer) - we spent all the money on building a recording studio, a rehearsal room and buying decent quality instruments which we still have. The advance for our 4th album on Candlelight was pretty large (because I negotiated VERY hard when we signed) but I have no problems now saying we didn't want to remain on Candlelight any more (for a variety of reasons), and they didn't want us either so they let us go.

[Those Insane Gods]

That's one perspective. But what about the DIY scene etc? I recently heard an interview with Hamburg Techno legends X-Dream. They said that a lot of people really doesn't realize what a revolution the internet-boom has been for music. How the tables have been turned 180 degrees. Today the listener selects the music of the day. Back in the 80's and early 90's the industry was EVERYTHING. They picked the artist they wanted you to hear and you really had no choice. Today there are loads of bands who are not even on labels. But people still listen to them. So it's not just a lose/lose situation. It's more complicated than that. The industry's job today is merely to physically document the history of music. I don't know if that is a bad thing.

[L Macey]

its true that the industry has been turned on it's head, theres upsides for listeners as music is instantly available but the value of music has been vastly diminished as a result.



But bands can now do it sans labels if they choose and that's the route many are taking now, which is a good thing.

[Those Insane Gods]

[quote name="L Macey"]its true that the industry has been turned on it's head, theres upsides for listeners as music is instantly available but the value of music has been vastly diminished as a result.



But bands can now do it sans labels if they choose and that's the route many are taking now, which is a good thing.[/quote]



Agreed and don't get me wrong. I got every point you wrote above. Evolution is nowhere near being perfect. But when it comes to quality... I'm not exactly sure if it's been diminished. There's just a whole lot of everything out there now. Both good and bad. I think people on our age tend to stick with what they used to listen to. That also explains why so few in the Metal scene cared (enough) to get into Heretic. That's probably also the reason why Illud Divinum Insanus has turned out the way it has.



Anyway... Reading a magazine like Wired proves that there is A LOT going on. All the time.

[jawn galliano]

[quote name="L Macey"]The net has enabled people to just chuck anything out there and has lowered the quality control aspect for sure, which has made it harder for people to find decent music.[/quote]



From my perspective, if there's one major downside to the last decade of technological advancements, ubiquity of high-speed/high-bandwidth connections and so forth, it's this. The signal-to-noise ratio has been tilted really, really heavily in favor of the latter. And it wasn't especially great to begin with.

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]
[quote name="L Macey"]its true that the industry has been turned on it's head, theres upsides for listeners as music is instantly available but the value of music has been vastly diminished as a result.



But bands can now do it sans labels if they choose and that's the route many are taking now, which is a good thing.[/quote]



Agreed and don't get me wrong. I got every point you wrote above. Evolution is nowhere near being perfect. But when it comes to quality... I'm not exactly sure if it's been diminished. There's just a whole lot of everything out there now. Both good and bad. I think people on our age tend to stick with what they used to listen to. That also explains why so few in the Metal scene cared (enough) to get into Heretic. That's probably also the reason why Illud Divinum Insanus has turned out the way it has.



Anyway... Reading a magazine like Wired proves that there is A LOT going on. All the time.[/quote]

There's a difference between quality and value. Wired is a shit magazine.

[Those Insane Gods]

[quote name="pulsar"]There's a difference between quality and value. Wired is a shit magazine.[/quote]



I haven't followed Wired too closely but a fellating lover of mine has. Can't really say I'm an expert though. Why do you feel it's a shit magazine?

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]
[quote name="pulsar"]There's a difference between quality and value. Wired is a shit magazine.[/quote]



I haven't followed Wired too closely but a fellating lover of mine has. Can't really say I'm an expert though. Why do you feel it's a shit magazine?[/quote]

Sensationalism, terrible science, bad writing

[Those Insane Gods]

[quote name="pulsar"]Sensationalism, terrible science, bad writing[/quote]



They are known to be one of the most serious and cutting edge music magazines out there. Plus having some of the best writers. Dissemination of knowledge is an art form in itself I guess. It's always a matter of opinion. The part of Wired I find most impressive is the scope. They cover everything from mainstream music to the most super obscure niches. I think that's pretty cool. Rolling Stone just do their usual Joy Division feature and some retrospective on 60's rock or whatever. Always the same. But then again... I rarely read music magazines. So I could be missing out on a lot.

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]
[quote name="pulsar"]Sensationalism, terrible science, bad writing[/quote]



They are known to be one of the most serious and cutting edge music magazines out there. Plus having some of the best writers. Dissemination of knowledge is an art form in itself I guess. It's always a matter of opinion. The part of Wired I find most impressive is the scope. They cover everything from mainstream music to the most super obscure niches. I think that's pretty cool. Rolling Stone just do their usual Joy Division feature and some retrospective on 60's rock or whatever. Always the same. But then again... I rarely read music magazines. So I could be missing out on a lot.[/quote]

[Conservative_Heretic]

[quote name="pulsar"]
[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]
[quote name="pulsar"]Sensationalism, terrible science, bad writing[/quote]



They are known to be one of the most serious and cutting edge music magazines out there. Plus having some of the best writers. Dissemination of knowledge is an art form in itself I guess. It's always a matter of opinion. The part of Wired I find most impressive is the scope. They cover everything from mainstream music to the most super obscure niches. I think that's pretty cool. Rolling Stone just do their usual Joy Division feature and some retrospective on 60's rock or whatever. Always the same. But then again... I rarely read music magazines. So I could be missing out on a lot.[/quote]

[/quote]

[Those Insane Gods]

Not trashing Wired is apparently like being a fan of Cradle of Filth these days. I don't follow that shit enough to have all the cool opinions. Sorry about that fellaz. I personally thought the special they did on fundamentalist Islamic music was pretty awesome. That's all I have to say about that.

[Victor Frankenstein]

The thing with magazines is the same thing with music. They sell, someone has to buy. So they have to be attractive to everyone.

[vO)))id]

That's true for magazines, but certainly not for music. It is for mainstream populair music though...

[Olden Polynice]

L Macey,On the whole labels..downloading..quality music..ect.Would it be a loss for bands to not have a recording advance/budget?Also,distribution hook ups?..

[RitesOfPossession]

One thing I would say about the quality issue is that whilst advances in recording and communications technology have allowed lots of low quality bands to get their music out it has also done the same for some very good bands.



During the early-era of the gloryhole death metal boom there were lots of mediocre bands who got signed and put out records and some absolutely stellar bands who never got past the demo stage because they didn't manage to get signed. It's great that bands who might not have attracted label attention can now record their own music to a reasonably high standard and distribute it worldwide on the internet, despite the fact that mediocre bands can do the same thing.



And because the internet is so fast, and the MP3 format is so convenient for sharing quickly and for free it allows you to listen to vast amounts of music in a short space of time and make up your own mind. Its not like having to wait a few weeks for a tape to arrive from the other side of the world only to find out that it's crap.

[Those Insane Gods]

[quote name="DarkSurgeon"]During the early-era of the gloryhole death metal boom there were lots of mediocre bands who got signed and put out records and some absolutely stellar bands who never got past the demo stage because they didn't manage to get signed. It's great that bands who might not have attracted label attention can now record their own music to a reasonably high standard and distribute it worldwide on the internet, despite the fact that mediocre bands can do the same thing.[/quote]



Ripping Corpse comes to mind. They recorded an album full of demo material because they expected to do a second record the following year. Label went bankrupt. They couldn't find a new one. The band broke up. That wouldn't have been the case had this happened today.

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]Not trashing Wired is apparently like being a fan of Cradle of Filth these days. I don't follow that shit enough to have all the cool opinions. Sorry about that fellaz. I personally thought the special they did on fundamentalist Islamic music was pretty awesome. That's all I have to say about that.[/quote]

You're a daft cunt if you think it's a case where one must follow some popular opinion. That shit isn't for here. I trash Wired and love me some old Cradle of Filth. I was laughing hysterically that you think Wired has "some of the best writers."

[Those Insane Gods]

[quote name="pulsar"]
[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]Not trashing Wired is apparently like being a fan of Cradle of Filth these days. I don't follow that shit enough to have all the cool opinions. Sorry about that fellaz. I personally thought the special they did on fundamentalist Islamic music was pretty awesome. That's all I have to say about that.[/quote]

You're a daft cunt if you think it's a case where one must follow some popular opinion. That shit isn't for here. I trash Wired and love me some old Cradle of Filth. I was laughing hysterically that you think Wired has "some of the best writers."[/quote]



Some people just can't understand irony. I think you misunderstood me on this one. It wasn't something I thought. It's what most music journalists in my country thinks. They all worship that magazine.

[RitesOfPossession]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]Some people just can't understand irony[/quote]

This isn't a dig at you or anyone else in particular but I absolutely loathe that phrase. Half the time that those words get thrown around its because someone's irony wasn't good enough or clear enough in the first place.

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]It wasn't something I thought. It's what most music journalists in my country thinks. They all worship that magazine.[/quote]

What damn fool country are you from?



[quote name="DarkSurgeon"]
[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]Some people just can't understand irony[/quote]

This isn't a dig at you or anyone else in particular but I absolutely loathe that phrase. Half the time that those words get thrown around its because someone's irony wasn't good enough or clear enough in the first place.[/quote]

Took the words out of my mouth.

[Those Insane Gods]

[quote name="DarkSurgeon"]
[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]Some people just can't understand irony[/quote]

This isn't a dig at you or anyone else in particular but I absolutely loathe that phrase. Half the time that those words get thrown around its because someone's irony wasn't good enough or clear enough in the first place.[/quote]



Or because the written word isn't the most optimal medium for discussion. Pulsar should probably just listen a little more to Formulas. That might teach him the art of taming the ego. Calling people a "daft cunt" after having posted a bunch of smilies is just useless in every possible every way.









Ps. More useless than any article Wired ever published I'm sure lol.

[Drum Solo]

[quote name="pulsar"]
[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]It wasn't something I thought. It's what most music journalists in my country thinks. They all worship that magazine.[/quote]

What damn fool country are you from?



[quote name="DarkSurgeon"]
[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]Some people just can't understand irony[/quote]

This isn't a dig at you or anyone else in particular but I absolutely loathe that phrase. Half the time that those words get thrown around its because someone's irony wasn't good enough or clear enough in the first place.[/quote]

Took the words out of my mouth.[/quote]



Do yourself a favor and calm the fuck down about Wired Magazine, Scorpion.

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]
[quote name="DarkSurgeon"]
[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]Some people just can't understand irony[/quote]

This isn't a dig at you or anyone else in particular but I absolutely loathe that phrase. Half the time that those words get thrown around its because someone's irony wasn't good enough or clear enough in the first place.[/quote]



Or because the written word isn't the most optimal medium for discussion. Pulsar should probably just listen a little more to Formulas. That might teach him the art of taming the ego. Calling people a "daft cunt" after having posted a bunch of smilies is just useless in every possible every way.









Ps. More useless than any article Wired ever published I'm sure lol. [/quote]

Please explain in what manner the use of emoticons lessens the efficacy of calling one a 'daft cunt', or how my ego, in whatever form, is in any way related to the discussion. Your reasoning is arbitrary.



[quote name="Drum Solo"]Do yourself a favor and calm the fuck down about Wired Magazine, Scorpion.[/quote]

In what way would me discontinuing my opinion of Wired do me any favors, "Drum Solo"?

[Drum Solo]

You'll sound like much less of a nerdy cunt, you nerdy cunt.

[jawn galliano]

it's not about doing you favors, it's about losing the disproportionate level of hostility over such a trivial subject (which has nothing to do with anything in the first place) and showing a little tact.



yes i am aware of the absurdity of that statement coming from me. oh well

[Abzu]

I'm good with sounding like a nerdy cunt, you thick fuck.

[Drum Solo]

GET OVER HERE!...you nerdy cunt

[Abzu]

[quote name="Derek Waters"]it's not about doing you favors, it's about losing the disproportionate level of hostility over such a trivial subject (which has nothing to do with anything in the first place) and showing a little tact.



yes i am aware of the absurdity of that statement coming from me. oh well[/quote]



BRRAAAAHH WIRED MUST BURN

I just think it's a shit rag, mostly due to its inclusion of a good bit of antiscience/pseudoscience garbage.



I'm half tongue in cheek here, but some seem to get a bit butthurt over it.

[Abzu]

[quote name="Drum Solo"]GET OVER HERE!...you nerdy cunt [/quote]

[Those Insane Gods]

Pulsar, your answer only serves to prove my point. Why don't YOU start by explaining why Wired Magazine sucks so bad that you would feel the need to trash-talk a stranger who said he thought one of their articles was good.











... Actually don't even bother. I don't care enough about your opinion for it to be worth it. An apology would be more fitting.

[jawn galliano]

[quote name="pulsar"]
[quote name="Derek Waters"]it's not about doing you favors, it's about losing the disproportionate level of hostility over such a trivial subject (which has nothing to do with anything in the first place) and showing a little tact.



yes i am aware of the absurdity of that statement coming from me. oh well[/quote]



BRRAAAAHH WIRED MUST BURN

I just think it's a shit rag[/quote]



well that's true of pretty much every magazine, and also any news outlet with regards to science reporting, outside of maaaybe a few highly specialized publications. if you want to know about the latest in a given field, get a journal subscription, is basically your best option.

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]Pulsar, your answer only serves to prove my point. Why don't YOU start by explaining why Wired Magazine sucks so bad that you would feel the need to trash-talk a stranger who said he thought one of their articles was good.











... Actually don't even bother. I don't care enough about your opinion for it to be worth it. An apology would be more fitting.[/quote]

I already explained it



I already explained it





An apology?

[Abzu]

[quote name="Derek Waters"]
[quote name="pulsar"]
[quote name="Derek Waters"]it's not about doing you favors, it's about losing the disproportionate level of hostility over such a trivial subject (which has nothing to do with anything in the first place) and showing a little tact.



yes i am aware of the absurdity of that statement coming from me. oh well[/quote]



BRRAAAAHH WIRED MUST BURN

I just think it's a shit rag[/quote]



well that's true of pretty much every magazine, and also any news outlet with regards to science reporting, outside of maaaybe a few highly specialized publications. if you want to know about the latest in a given field, get a journal subscription, is basically your best option.[/quote]

Amen.

[Those Insane Gods]

It tends to puzzle me whenever I stumble over a user with more than 11.000 posts. But what at first seems like an incomprehensible fact quickly becomes clear like the water in my toilet. Fight on little pony, fight on.

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]It tends to puzzle me whenever I stumble over a user with more than 11.000 posts. But what at first seems like an incomprehensible fact quickly becomes clear like the water in my toilet. Fight on little pony, fight on.





[/quote]





Fuck knows what you would have thought of the admins in the previous incarnations, then? Was that some sort of dig? Silly thing, you.



:lcok:

[Verbal]

he himself has more than 11 posts

[Abzu]

[quote name="Verbal"]he himself has more than 11 posts[/quote]



I had this discussion with Void not too long ago.

[Those Insane Gods]

[quote name="pulsar"]
[quote name="Verbal"]he himself has more than 11 posts[/quote]



I had this discussion with Void not too long ago.[/quote]



I'm sure the conclusions must have been ground-breaking!

[Abzu]

[quote name="WhereTheSlimeLives"]
[quote name="pulsar"]
[quote name="Verbal"]he himself has more than 11 posts[/quote]



I had this discussion with Void not too long ago.[/quote]



I'm sure the conclusions must have been ground-breaking! [/quote]

[Verbal]

whos this cunt

[zim]

alright kids

[Those Insane Gods]

[quote name="Verbal"] whos this cunt[/quote]



Your mothers!









Ok I'm done now lol. Let's get this thread back on track.